Caffeine is good for migraines?

That is very true. But it is sometimes difficult to find the balance between not doing enough (and getting worse) and doing too much (and getting worse as well). I guess, it is trial and error many times.

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Migraine Buddy had the attached in my feed this morning. Since my cardiologist took me off caffeine four or five months ago, Iā€™ve experienced a steady increase in the frequency of my Vestibular Migraines. Iā€™ve asked her (my cardiologist) if just one cup a day of caffeinated coffee would be okay. Iā€™ll let you know what she says.

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Interesting. It could just be a coincidence, or it could be that a small amount of caffeine really helped you. Let us know what your cardiologist says.

I talked with a friend of mine who has a history of ā€œnormalā€ migraines (no aura, no vestibular symptoms, but bad headaches). She said that she has used caffeine to stop migraine attacks, it sometimes worked, sometimes it did not.

I like your article, it is in line with what my neurologist said. It is now 3 days since I had my cup of green tea and I have not had any migraine symptoms. Will have another cup in a day or two.

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In my diary, I posted that my cardiologist gave me the okay for 12 oz a day. If I canā€™t get relief with a big cup of leaded coffee, more isnā€™t likely to help. Iā€™m not going to have it every morning, just those mornings I need help.

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Interestingly Iā€™ve never been advised by any medic to cut caffeine but I attempted it as a result of my reading. Iā€™m a tea drinker rather than coffee drinker but I gradually cut it down and down over a few weeks with no trouble until after I stopped completely. Moved over to decaf tea though appreciate its not totally caffeine free. Couple of days later started having some really serious objective vertigo - the worst kind, the BPPV type stuff. At that point I hadnā€™t had true vertigo for ages. Back on the one daily cup of caffeinated tea and it stopped. Ever since I have just the one per day. Anymore (once given one in error by sister-in-law) brought on vestibular attack which is what I get rather than migraine, a vestibular attack with accompanying rear head pressure. My own version I guess.

That sounds like your ā€˜sweet spotā€™. I am still hoping to find mine as far as green tea is concerned.

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Ooooh yes I can attest to this. Far outā€¦ deep into my vestibular attack - both peripheral and central, I decided there was no better time to quit the caffeine cold turkey. The actual worst! 2 weeks of withdrawal. Migraines galore. Years and years of coffee every day. Couldnā€™t get to 11am on a normal day without a headache type addicted. Iā€™m almost a year in, and although I miss it, I donā€™t need it anymore. And if itā€™s keeping my brain quiet than thatā€™s great! Staying off and saving me heaps.

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Thankfully, I was only a little fatigued when I stopped. But I only ever drank 1-2 cups of coffee a day or some espresso. Itā€™s so odd how caffeine didnā€™t bother me at all for years and now the tiniest amount will send me to bed for the day. I really miss it, but itā€™s not worth the extra suffering for now. And I find I have just as much energy without it, except when I increase my propranolol doseā€¦

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Funnily enough, when I have migraine pain coming on coffee and chocolate help take away the pain. They have no effect on the vertigo aspect though. For me, if I had a headache the vertigo was better, no headache the vertigo was worse.

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That sounds very severe. I was more like @dizzyqueen when I stopped my coffee and tea, just a bit fatigued. However, I also only ever drank 1-2 cups of green tea a day or one or two cups of coffee a week. Sometimes I went for weeks without a coffee, particularly when we were in lockdown. I donā€™t like takeaway coffee or instant coffee, so the lockdown meant no coffee for me. But what did happen when I stopped drinking green tea was my brain said ā€œI want green tea, I want green teaā€, throughout the day, like a naught little child who canā€™t be reasoned with. Luckily this is all gone now.

An update on my caffeine experiment: In the last three weeks I drank green tea (Japanese or Vietnamese mountain tea) on six days in the morning (one cup). I had one aura event (that includes stiff neck, nausea and dizziness) one day after one of the tea-drinking days. The aura lasted for about 30 minutes, the other symptoms lasted for about three days. On all the other tea-drinking days I had no negative symptoms. But I had significantly more energy and felt better in myself.

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Is it really? Isnā€™t it the chocolates have caffeine too. And too much chocolate causes migraines.

Hmmmā€¦

Another update on my caffeine experiment: I decided to drink my first cup of coffee since March (a flat white with almond milk) in my favourite cafĆ© last Friday. I was ok on Friday, but felt ā€œoffā€ on Saturday. My eyes were not able to focus properly and I felt as if a visual aura was about to happen any minute. I was also very tired. I spent the day at home, mostly in the garden, because of the way I felt. The aura did not eventuate, maybe the Pizotifen played a role in this. I was better on Sunday and back to ā€œnormalā€ on Monday.

I am fine with drinking my green tea, I feel rather good when I drink it. But clearly, the coffee was not good for me. Now I am wondering, are there different types of caffeine in green tea and coffee? Or is it because there is more caffeine in coffee than in green tea? Or any other explanation I canā€™t think of?

Thereā€™s 2-3x more caffeine in coffee, see Diet

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Tea is much lower in caffeine than coffee but just wondered could the cafe environment itself have had some influence. Some additional environmental stimulation maybe? Nearly all my attacks followed restaurant visits.

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That is good thinking! But I donā€™t think it contributed because there were not many people in the cafe and I had a place outside. I also was by myself because I wanted to enjoy the coffee without any distraction.

Iā€™ve been off caffeine for about three months now. I was at a wedding this weekend and had a coffee after my meal without thinking! I was fine although I didnā€™t sleep well later not sure if it was just because the hotel room was warm and the bed uncomfortable.
We had an afternoon tea the next day which a friend of my husband had organised for a group of us and I had a couple of cups of normal tea as I didnā€™t want to make a fuss- so far so goodā€¦

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Iā€™m going to be experimenting with green tea (before 12pm).

One of my (few) theories is this is all caused by inner ear hydrops. Yes, even the migraines. One of the potential solutions for this (according to some, an apparently reversible condition), is taking a diuretic.

I experimented for a short time with my original oto-neurologist with taking a ā€˜water pillā€™, when hydrops was discussed as a possible cause as an alternative to my initial ā€˜MAVā€™ diagnosis, but it didnā€™t appear to help. Maybe it just takes time? And what if there is a more natural, gentler solution without taking prescription medication?

Now my theory is black tea, whilst a good diuretic has too much caffeine which will be too much for your neurology, potentially causing an increase in anxiety, which itself will produce too much anti-diuretic hormone (ADH, that is thought by some to cause the hydrops in the first place; ie ā€œstress causes MAVā€?!) negating the effect of the diuretic - so thatā€™s out.

For example, even when healthy, I remember a spaced-out, almost a derealisation feeling when drinking too much coffee. This happened a lot when I was a student.

What you want is a very slow reduction in hydrops over time. Too much fluctuation is going to confuse the brain as your inner ear changes its response to movement too much. As you might imagine, changes in hydrodynamic pressure within the inner ear is going to change the way it reports movement. This is why hydrops is such a convincing villain. Significant fluctuation in inner ear hydrops is going to upset all the vestibular calibration. My thought is that when you ear is not in a hydropic state, it is more resilient to normal, healthy fluctuations (then again, think back to times youā€™ve felt weird after too much coffee).

Whilst my vestibular and neurological symptoms are under control, I still have the very same audiological and somatic tinnitus that came on a week into my very first chronic MAV symptoms. My feeling is that it has eased some, but far from completely. I also reckon itā€™s possible my amazing brain (youā€™ve got one too) has compensated for the hydrops as far as it is able and this means Iā€™m not suffering the vestibular symptoms anymore. ā€¦ but, for example, if I jerk my head to the side, I can temporarily increase my tinnitus for an instant as if my ear is like a blown up balloon. This never happened before for my entire life. One of my frustrations with my oto-neurologist is that she was unable to explain this phenomenon and didnā€™t seem keen to pursue it.

So, whilst caffeine is contradicted for MAV sufferers, I wonder if this is just for when itā€™s at its worse phase. Could a mild level of caffeine actually help in the long term?

So green tea, can you be my saviour?

NB for this to work you also have to eliminate stress as much as possible and avoid injury, both of which increase ADH.

btw, donā€™t get any ideas, but alcohol is also an inhibitor of ADH! :sweat_smile:

Very interesting experiment and theory!

I am back to drinking a cup of green tea each morning after I get up. I use loose tea, mostly Japanese green tea, sometimes Vietnamese mountain oolong. Sometimes I make a second cup with the already used tea leaves after breakfast. I have not found any negative effects on my vertigo. I am not sure if it has positive effects, possibly yes, because I have been able to decrease my medication (Pizotifen) from four tablets to one.

I have tried black tea as well, but find it too strong for me. I am not sure how this works, because green, oolong and black teas are made from the same plant (camelia sinensis) and the only difference is the processing. So it should have the same amount of caffeine, but somehow black tea feels wrong for me.

I read an interesting book by a thyroid surgeon in Brisbane (Australia) who wrote about foods that are protective against cancer. One of these foods is green tea. His argument is that, to take advantage of the anticancer properties, the water for the green tea needs to be boiling hot and it needs to steep with the tea leaves for five minutes. So I am doing that to take advantage of the anticancer properties.

I have tried to drink coffee, but every trial was unsuccessful. Coffee makes my brain go hyper and agitated - not a good state to be in.

Iā€™d be keen to hear the results of your experiment @turnitaround.

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That is great news about how youā€™ve been able to reduce your medication :+1: :+1: Thatā€™s surely significant progress!

The problem with these kind of experiments is they take so much time to show benefits and you can never be sure it wasnā€™t time that fixed it for you in the first place. Or your discipline to reduce stress ā€¦ or ā€¦ just so many variables ā€¦ :sweat_smile:

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