Does Anything Actually Help MAV

I must say, this is a very frustrating condition - being motion sick all day long. Does anything actually help at all? I have been unsuccessful in finding anything that helps - except possibly for Nortriptyline - which causes my blood pressure and pulse rate to skyrocket.

-Op

Hey Op,

What meds have you tried to date? Also, what lifestyle mods have you made? Can you tighten things up on lifestyle fixes do you think?

Scott

Hi Scott,

I have tried the diet recommended in the Bucholtz (sp?) book. It didn’t help me. I have found that coming-off of coffee is really tough. I did without coffee for 1 year - didn’t help. I am back to 1 cup per day.

I pretty much do the migraine lifestyle with regular sleep, etc. But I still have nearly constant motion sickness/nausea. Getting through work each day is a monumental challenge. I actually need to pose as a relatively normal human being when I am there.

I may have to try another med. Only have tried the Nortiptyline. Dr. has recommended Propranolol. I don’t like to take meds…but there may be little choice.

Have you ever heard of a 5 day lamb and pear diet eliminating migraine symptoms? Read about a study with striking results.

-Op

Op,

I feel car sick 24 hours a day so I know what you are going through. It is a horrible feeling.

I tried nortrip but without much luck. I had to stop after 1 month because I had such terrible insomnia, which is a really strange side effect for a drug that is often used to treat insomnia.

The lamb/pear diet is a form of the elimination diet. It’s worth a shot. Earlier this year I gave up eating just about everything - wheat, dairy, chocolate, much more. And even before this I was pretty much adhereing to both a meniere’s and anti-migraine diet. So I am extremely limited in what I eat. For awhile it seemed to help, I even had days where I felt GOOD but then I started feeling not good again. I’d say I’m maybe about 15-20% better. I have noticed when I put a food back into my diet I feel really bad 2-3 days later. But I still dont’ have a 100% clear cut idea of exactly which foods are my problem (or if any are and everything is just a co-indidence.) Every morning about 10:30 I suddenly feel very car sick for a couple of hours. This doesn’t seem to go away and I don’t know what is causing it. I can’t imagine having to give up any more food to try to find out.

Have you tried meclizine? That has helped me somewhat though I don’t like to take it every day. I have found that ofen ibuprofen helps also.

book

Op,

When I first read about the lamb and pear diet I was thinking WHAT? But Book is right. It’s part of an elimination diet as far as I know. I think it’s the one where, in the end, they found that wheat was the biggest trigger in some 60% of cases. I could never find the study to look at how well it was carried out because I am skeptical about wheat being that big a trigger in so many people. The funny thing is, is that I would almost certainly have migraines from eating pears. LOL. I can’t win.

It sounds like you’ve done your best with lifestyle and coffee. For some coffee should be eliminated and for others not. Lucky you – coffee is ok.

On the meds front, if you’ve gone to the highest dose you can tolerate (without becoming a zombie with lethargy) on Nori and given it a good bunch of time, I’d definitely move on and give propranolol a go.

Cheers … Scott

Hi Op,
There are things I havent done that I should have , such as keeping an everyday diary.
I’m like bookworm, I have my migrianes like clockwork every morning and feel crap for the rest of the day.

I’m always trying new meds.
there is a very large list some where on the site, I got it from the migraine.org by Terri Roberts,

I was chatting with my hubby this morning , he believes since I’ve been on my Antidepressant my mav has escelated in frequency , but My symptoms of referred pain have gone, which was a huge bonus, but that’s about it , I’m afraid.

I’m now trying propranolol, I havent been on it long enough to say if it’s going to continue to help.

Here is the post , And I hear Terri has added more over the years.

Headache and Migraine Preventives:
It’s Impossible to Have Tried Everything!
When discussing preventive medications, it’s not at all unusual to
hear someone with frequent Migraines or headaches say, “I’ve tried
everything!” In the reality of today’s headache and Migraine
medicine, that’s just not possible. As you can see from the list
below, there are over 100 medications and dietary supplements, as
well as at least one medical device, being used successfully for
headache and Migraine prevention. There are also virtually endless
combinations of them. Many people find that it’s not a single
medication or supplement that ends up being successful for them, but
a combination of preventives.
The following medications are being used successfully by some
headache and Migraine patients as preventive medications. They’re
listed first by their generic names, followed by some of their brand
names.

ANTIHYPERTENSIVES (blood pressure meds)
Alpha-2 agonists:

Clonidine, aka Catapres
Guanfacine, aka Tenex
ACE Inhibitors:

Benazepril, aka Lotensin
Captopril, aka Capoten
Enalapril, aka Vasotec
Fosinopril, aka Monopril
Lisinopril, aka Zestril, Prinivil
Moexipril, aka Univasc
Perindopril, aka Aceon
Quinapril, aka Accupril
Ramipril, aka Altace
Trandolapril, aka Mavik

Alzheimer’s/Dementia Medicaton:

Memantine, aka Namenda

Angiotensin II Inhibitors:

Candesartan, aka Atacand
Eprosartan, aka Teveten
Irbesartan, aka Avapro
Losartan, aka Cozaar
Olmesartan, aka Benicar
Telmisartan, aka Midcardis
Valsartan, aka Diovan

Beta Blockers:

Acebutolol, aka Secral
Atenolol, aka Tenormin
Betaxolol, aka Kerlone
Bisoprolol, aka Zebeta, Emconcor
Cartelol, aka Cartrol
Labetalol, aka Normodyne, Trandate
Metoprolol, aka Lopressor
Nadolol, aka Corgard
Penbutololm aka Levatol
Pindolol, aka Visken, Syn-Pindolol
Propranolol, aka Inderal
Timolol, aka Blocadren

Calcium Channel Blockers:

Amlodipine, aka Norvasc
Bepridil, aka Vascor
Diltiazem, aka Cardizem, Tiazac
Felodipine, aka Plendil
Flunarizine, aka Sibelium (Canada)
Isradipine, aka DynaCirc
Nicardipine, aka Cardene
Nifedipine, aka Adalat, Procardia
Nimodipine, aka Nimotop
Nisoldipine, aka Sular
Verapamil, aka Calan, Verelan, Isoptin

ANTIHISTAMINES:

Cyproheptadine, aka Periactin
Pizotifen, aka Sandomigran (UK)

ANTIDEPRESSANTS
Tricyclic antidepressants (TCAs):

Amitriptyline, aka Elavil (discontinued), Endep
Amoxapine, aka Asendin
Clomipramine, aka, Anafranil
Desipramine, aka Norpramin
Doxepin, aka Sinequan
Imipramine, aka Norfranil, Tofranil
Nortriptyline, aka Pamelor, Aventyl
Protriptyline, aka Vivactil
Trimipramine, aka Surmontil
MAOI Antidepressants:

Isocarboxazid, aka Marplan
Phenelzine, aka Nardil
Tranylcypromine, aka Parnate
Selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors (SSRIs):

Citalopram, aka Celexa
Escitalopram oxalate, aka Lexapro
Fluoxetine, aka Prozac
Fluvoxamine, aka Luvox
Paroxetine, aka Paxil
Sertraline, aka Zoloft
Selective serotonin and norepinephrine reuptake inhibitors (SSNRIs):

Duloxetine hydrochloride, aka Cymbalta
Venlafaxine, aka Effexor, Effexor XR
Other Antidepressants:

Bupropion, aka Wellbutrin, Zyban
Mirtazepine, aka Remeron
Trazodone, aka Desyrel

Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder Meds:

Dextroamphetamine, aka Adderall
Atomoxetine HCl, aka Strattera
Methylphenidate HCl, aka Concerta, Ritalin
Pemoline, aka Cylert

ARTHRITIS MEDS
Cox-2 Enzyme Inhibitors:

Celecoxib, aka Celebrex

MUSCLE RELAXANTS:

Carisoprodol, aka Soma
Cyclobenzaprine, aka Flexeril
Lioresal, aka Baclofen
Metaxalone, aka Skelaxin
Tizanidine, aka Zanaflex

NEURONAL STABILIZING AGENTS (antiseizure meds)
Many people call this class of medications “antiseizure
medications.” Actually, these meds are neuronal stabilizing agents.
They work to stabilize the neuronal activity in the brain.
Considering that Migraineurs have overactive neurons in the brain
that, when a trigger is encountered, start firing in a wave and
start a chain reaction that produces the symptoms of a Migraine
attack, it makes sense to use them for Migraine prevention. These
meds are only antiseizure meds when they’re being used to prevent
seizure activity.

Carbamazepine, aka Tegretol
Clonazepam, Klonopin
Clorazepate, aka Tranxene
Divalproex, aka Depakote
Gabapentin, aka Neurontin
Levetiracetam, Keppra
Lamotrigine, aka Lamictal
Oxcarbazepine, Trileptal
Tiagabine, aka Gabitril
Topiramate, aka Topamax
Valproate Sodium, aka Depacon
Zonisamide, aka Zonegran
Pregabalin, aka Lyrica

ERGOT ALKALOID:

Methylergonovine, aka Methergine (the only ergot used as a
preventive)

LEUKOTRIENE BLOCKERS:

Montelukast, aka Singulair
Zafirlukast, aka Accolate
Zyleuton, aka Zyflo

OTHER:

Baclofen, aka Lioresal
Botulinum Toxin Type A, aka Botox
Memantine, aka Namenda

DIETARY SUPPLEMENTS:

Coenzyme Q10
Feverfew
Butterbur, aka Petadolex
Magnesium
Vitamin B2
5-HTP (Check carefully with doctor because of interactions with meds
including triptans and SSRIs)
Lecithin
Melatonin

DEVICES:

The NTI Tension Suppression System, invented by Dr. Jim Boyd, has
proven quite effective for some people who have problems with
clenching or grinding their teeth in their sleep.

This list will be updated as more medications are successfully used
for headache and Migraine prevention. If you’re having problems
finding an effective preventive regimen, sharing this list with your
doctor may be helpful to you.

References:

Ramadan, Nahib M., MD; Silberstein, Stephen D., Md, FACP; Frietag,
Frederick G., DO; Gilbert, Thomas T., MD, MPH; Frishberg, Benjamin
M., MD. “Evidence-Based Guidelines for Migraine Headache in the
Primary Care Setting: Pharmacological Management for Prevention of
Migraine.” American Academy of Neurology Practice Guidelines.
September, 2000.

Just to throw my two cents in, if you are have problems with nausea from constant motion sickness, try ginger. There are many forms you can try, ginger ale is the most obvious, ginger candy, ginger cookies, even extract available in capsule form. It won’t help with any of the other symptoms with motion sickness but it usually helps with nausea.

— Begin quote from “Brian B”

Just to throw my two cents in, if you are have problems with nausea from constant motion sickness, try ginger. There are many forms you can try, ginger ale is the most obvious, ginger candy, ginger cookies, even extract available in capsule form. It won’t help with any of the other symptoms with motion sickness but it usually helps with nausea.

— End quote

You can also purchase the pure ginger powder at many health food stores in the states. Take a half teaspoon and mix with juice and it works within minutes , at least for me. Many Ginger Ales do not have real ginger in them only flavoring. You can find some brands but read the labels to make sure “ginger” had been added. Great tip Brian…and it does not cause side effects …nice change.

— Begin quote from “Timeless”

You can also purchase the pure ginger powder at many health food stores in the states. Take a half teaspoon and mix with juice and it works within minutes , at least for me. Many Ginger Ales do not have real ginger in them only flavoring. You can find some brands but read the labels to make sure “ginger” had been added. Great tip Brian…and it does not cause side effects …nice change.

— End quote

Timeless, you are right about the ginger ale. I forgot that you have to read the label to avoid imitation flavoring. I avoid artificial everything so much that I do it without thought these days. Thanks for pointing that out. :smiley:

All,

Thanks very much for the replies.

Scott, I did not go to the maximum usual dose for Nortrip. At only 20mg, my pulse rate and BP seemed to have skyrocketed and I took myself off of it.

I tried Meclizine once, and it didn’t seem to help. Also tried Dramamine - same result.

I have also tried ginger - both powdered and raw. I tried it for at least a month and it didn’t appear to help.

I’m not sure why nothing seems to help - thus far. But I plan to keep at it. I read about the lamb and pear diet but have been unable to find the original paper. I suspect it may be methodologically flawed. In any case, the claim is that migraine were all but eliminated in everyone who went on a 5 day lamb and pear diet. They drank only bottled water.

Recently (past day or two), I have cut-out all refined sugar, as suggested in Rudolpho Low’s “Victory Over Migraine.” The only sugars I am allowing are evaporated cane juice, pure maple syrup, and fructose from fruits.

I don’t get many headaches. I don’t get classic migraine headaches. My symptoms are severe sensitivity to actual motion and visual motion (can’t watch TV or ride as a passenger in a car), nausea from bright/flashing/flickering lights (sun through the trees as I’m driving is bad), and sensitivity to smells (e.g., perfumes and some colognes). I had tinnitus and sound sensitivity for 8 years before the MAV symptoms started (suddenly). My case is very weird. The MAV started instantly while I was in the shower after getting a small amount of water in my ear.

I am open to most anything at this point. 24/7 nausea is no joke. So keep the ideas and comments coming. Has anyone ever had MAV and experienced a marked improvement? Something has to help this most uncomfortable affliction.

-Op

— Begin quote from ____

I am open to most anything at this point. 24/7 nausea is no joke. So keep the ideas and comments coming. Has anyone ever had MAV and experienced a marked improvement? Something has to help this most uncomfortable affliction.

— End quote

Have you tried any of the medications for nausea…Zofran, Phenegran …they have helped many. I had side effects on both…chills with Zofran and go to sleep with Phengran…so that is why I opted for the ginger.

Hi Timeless,

No - those are strong medications, and I am medication averse as a rule. Has the ginger really helped you? How do you take it (in what form, how much)?

-Op

— Begin quote from “Call_Me_Op”

Hi Timeless,

No - those are strong medications, and I am medication averse as a rule. Has the ginger really helped you? How do you take it (in what form, how much)?

-Op

— End quote

Yes it does when the nausea gets really bad…I take the powered type. Take a quarter of a teaspoon and mix it with juice. It burns going down but the nausea is usually gone within thirty minutes. May have to repeat daily but it is worth it to me. No side effects other than the initial burning which goes away very quickly. We buy it in bulk very inexpensive.

Hmmmm…I think I used to take the ginger with food. I was afraid of hurting my stomach. Maybe that was why it was not so effective?

-Op

GINGER and nausea:

Motion Sickness

Several studies suggest that ginger may be more effective than placebo in reducing symptoms associated with motion sickness. In one trial of 80 novice sailors (prone to motion sickness), those who took powdered ginger experienced a significant reduction in vomiting and cold sweating compared to those who took placebo. Similar results were found in a study with healthy volunteers. While these results are promising, other studies suggest that ginger is not as effective as medications in reducing symptoms associated with motion sickness. In a small study of volunteers who were given ginger (fresh root and powder form), scopolamine (a medication commonly prescribed for motion sickness), or placebo, those receiving the medication experienced significantly fewer symptoms compared to those who received ginger.

Conventional prescription and nonprescription medicines that decrease nausea may also cause unwanted side effects, such as dry mouth and drowsiness. Given the safety of ginger, many people find it a welcome alternative to these medications to relieve motion sickness.

Nausea and vomiting following surgery

Research has produced mixed results regarding the use of ginger in the treatment of nausea and vomiting following surgery. Two studies found that 1 gram of ginger root before surgery reduced nausea as effectively as a leading medication. In one of these two studies, women who received ginger also required fewer nausea-relieving medications following surgery. Other studies, however, have failed to find the same positive effects. In fact, one study found that ginger may actually increase vomiting following surgery. More research is needed to determine whether ginger is safe and effective for the prevention and treatment of nausea and vomiting following surgery.

No clear answer on its efficacy but worth a try. Op, I think ginger is quite safe for the stomach.

Scott 8)

Call_Me_Op

I can not give you a “scientific based study” to tell you that it works on nausea, I can tell you that it worked for me. And I know other people that use it for nausea all the time.

Isadore Rosenfeld, M.D., a professor of medicine at New York Hospital Weil Cornell Medical Center and and contributing editor of Parade Magazine, is widely recognized as one of this country’s preeminent doctors recommended it a few weeks ago on his program as a treatment for nausea. He said that his wife uses it all the time for her nausea.

Dr. Rosenfeld is an attending physician at New York Hospital and Memorial Sloan Kettering Cancer Center and Rossi Distinguished Professor of Clinical Medicine at New York Hospital Weil Cornell Medical Center.He was president of the New York County Medical Society and was a member of The Practicing Physicians Advisory Council for the Secretary of Health and Human Services.

In addition to maintaining a private practice in Manhattan, Dr. Rosenfeld has served as a consultant to the National Institute of Health on such task forces as arteriosclerosis, sudden death and hypertension.He is the recipient of the first award for the achievement in cardiovascular medicine and science by the New York affiliate of the American Heart Association.

Dr. Rosenfeld received the United Nation’s Citizen of the World Award in November 1999 and the San Valentino D’Oro Gold Medal for Medicine.

I do not think he would be recommending it if he did not think it works and would be safe.

When I was totally disabled with MAV, I took a lot of Zofran. It helped me be able to eat and move around the house a little more without the carsick feeling so much. Don’t be afraid of it; it’s not strong, per se, it works on a specific area in the brain. I found that it helped without giving me any side effects. I still keep some around for travel.

I had a lot of chills, but mine were from migraine. It freaked me out until I figured out it was just yet another manifestation of migraine along with numbness/tingling.

For the nausea that accompanies the motion sickness I have had great results with acupressure bands for nausea - sometimes called Sea Bands. You just wear them on one or both wrists and they work within minutes. (I prefer the ones that fasten with velcro over the elastic ones.) I have used them for about 25 years for motion sickness, had one anesthesiologist put them on me prior to a surgery so I wouldn’t be nauseated after, and have even used them for nausea from the flu. They are pretty inexpensive and can be found at drugstores, health food stores and various sites online.