That sounds like your answer then. Fewer components in each outing seems to generate success. Go for it.
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Bump this thread.
So I was a fitness freak before all this MAV nonsense started. Lost 40 pounds and was on top of the world. First I herniated 2 discs in my lower back that set me back, rehabbed it on my own and was about 90%. The same week I got back into some workouts, MAV started in my life. Worst luck ever.
Long story short, Iām still trying to press on and modify workouts, its just not the same. I gained back a good 20 pounds and it sucks.
I notice though when i do anything that involves my heart rate getting upā¦jumping jacks, burpees, runningā¦I get very winded and dizzy. If I do stationary movements like bicep curls or shoulder pressā¦not as much. Do you guys have a similar problem? Seems like cardio is just too hard for my brain. Have any of you found a work around regiment? Thanks
Yes, cardio absolutely does me in. I got really into yoga, but since the pandemic shut my studio have been useless at practicing at home. In essence though, strength training seems to be better. When Iām feeling better I can do long-ish walks, but will not go running anymore as itās totally knocked me out before,
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I was going to post on here but lost my mojo halfway through and deleted it rather than finish it.
All part of how my MAV/VM seems to affect me. The spirit is willing but the flesh less so mainly due to MAV symptoms or amitriptyline side effects. Maybe another day.
Increase your electrolytes and target improving GLUT4 function. Walking helps as itās burning off glucose and stress hormones (which increases endogenous glucose production) without creating more.
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And maybe try ketosis as an add on since it gets to the same place.
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Hi, when I first developed MAV in 2018, I had to stop all cardio exercise as it made me extremely dizzy. Earlier this year after finding the root cause of the dizziness, I worked on cardio exercise again. I went on small walks until I became dizzy and stopping for the day. Once the dizziness subsided after a few days I would do the same walk and push a bit further, it was as though I had to retrain my brain again. I am now up to 20-30 mile hikes with no dizziness, which I never thought was possible.
Cycling is still a big no for me though, I think itās due to the amount of information that the brain receives in a short amount of time and canāt process it, so the outcome is to get dizzy.
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I would say itās more to do with aerobic vs anaerobic exercise and energy production? Even though dizziness is the call out feature of MAV, itās still just a symptom. Retraining the brain would make sense from a rehabilitation standpoint if MAV is generated from a single traumatic event but I donāt believe that.
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In my opinion, our bodies adjust differently to how we act. I used to exercise at first by doing few walks then I slowly did cardio until my body get used to it. I canāt deny the fact that Iām getting dizziness at first but, as time passes by, I no longer feel dizzy when exercising.
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Iāve said this in other Topics but once on Amitriptyline my dizziness subsided. However I was left with strong imbalance. However this disappeared when running or cycling, only to return when I slowed down to walking pace or when I go off the bike. I could sprint quite happily. In fact running was a good escape from vestibular symptoms.
My point is that if improvements are seen over time itās in the biochemistry and not the neurological. You wouldnāt see dramatic relapses otherwise.
I have found the same, Iām on my bike blasting away for 90 minutes, get off the bike and Iām woozy. Whatās the mechanism of action? Not information overload but a sudden drop in blood pressure Iād guess.
Serotonin increases (Amitriptyline) peripheral blood pressure and could stabilise cerebral blood flow.
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Different level of reliance on ears at slow speed. On a bike there is no push-pull motion. Off bike you are back to push-pull signals from ears.
Interesting. My understanding is totally different from yours.
I think looking at the ears is like the tail wagging the dog. How does an ear issue explain the plethora of symptoms people get and the fact that the majority of tinnitus sufferers have insulin issues?
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Ears are highly āphysiologicalā. Iāve posted papers before that show there is a strong link between diabetes and inner ear dysfunction. The fluids in the inner, whoās chemical constituency and physical properties like pressure rely on a whole boatload of processes functioning in the body correctly. These would include the hormonal system, autonomic system, blood chemistry. Itās all connected.
The original source of the problem may well not be the ears, but if the ears are relying on something which is no longer working as expected (e.g. blood sugar stability), you can see why your balance (or your hearing, or both) might be impacted.
The ears are clearly only part of the system, if crucial to balance.
The inner ears are the main source of information for the brain with respect to angle and acceleration.
Itās very obvious that the prevalence of BPPV symptoms amongst most MAVers pretty much proves inner ear involvement in the condition. Only an ear dysfunction could cause symptoms that are angle of orientation specific. (NB might stress this ādysfunctionā might be purely temporary and the root cause might be outside the inner ear)
Processing of balance, including the fluctuating signals from the inner ears takes up about 65% of processing in the brain, so any issues with the vestibular system are likely to cause neurological fallout, including issues involving the inner ear.
If the inner ear signal response changes with respect to learned signals, the brain is going to get confused and stressed, leading to all kinds of symptoms. Dizziness is probably the sensation of the brain expecting one set of signal patterns but actually getting another which diverges from what it expects. A dis-correlation between the ears (or lack of agreement) is one likely source of dizziness.
Iāve proposed before (with supporting paper) that migraines might actually be a result of excessive allostatic (stress) load on the brain and possibly a symptom of the brains learning algorithm being pushed to far, too fast, as the brainās systems scramble to understand the confusion of signals that are not correlated as expected and compensate.
Excessive tinnitus suggests something going wrong within the inner ear. Sure the brain again works hard to filter this noise out (we get more when we are tired), but I suspect beyond a certain threshold it is no longer able to mask it all.
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Ok, we arenāt worlds apart.
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A week or so ago you linked a paper that mentioned Vestibular Hyperexcitability after a warm bath. Its not information overload whilst listening to meditation music with the bathroom stinking of lavender.
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Haha. 
Does sound like a nice environment, but yeah, the issue could be an internal one, e.g. vasomotor response to warm water ā¦
ā¦ I mean the mind boggles wrt to the number of things the body is constantly trying to regulate and the interconnection between all systems and the potential impact of one system over-reacting.
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Hi Andy, I was speaking from personal experience. When walking now my heart rate will be around 110-120 for about 8 hours of walking, sometimes hitting 130 if walking up hill. I checked my heart when cycling and it was around 120-130 hitting 140 when pushing, so not much difference.
For me itās definitely sensory/information overload, as I used to get dizzy when in busy places. Iāve come to realise now that every MAV sufferer is individual.
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Sure, if thatās your experience Ben. I donāt doubt your observations.
Iām just challenging ideas and trying to draw similarities between people who experience MAV. Iād still look at elevated stress hormonesā¦ and how the body processes them in a crowded environment.