TMS for Mal de debarquement (MddS) syndrome

Hi All,

Jen sent me this link. I wonder if some of you with intractable symptoms where a migraine med and lifestyle has made no impact and you think there may be some MddS going on should try Transcranial Magnetic Stimulation (TMS)? Worth a shot.

Best … Scott 8)

Hey Scott,

Thank you so much for sharing this link!

Interesting stuff! If I were to do a research degree, I would love to study MDDS.

Thanks Scott for explaining TMS or at least defining the term.Bad reporting,doesn’t say what it is in the article or the video.
At first I thought it was TMJ when I glanced at the article.

Stress is a big factor,as some comedienne said we are so busy and stressed that we don’t even have time to say the disorders anymore.Just a bunch of letters.ADD;AHD,etc. I’m trying to interject some humor. :slight_smile:

I had this briefly for a few hours after an overnight boat trip and a friend who was with me had it for about 3 days.It was weird like you were still on the boat.

This is interesting. I had bad motion sickness as a child, couldnt travel in a car without sealegs (travel sickness pills). Travel hasnt affected me badly since, but just recently, twice it has. On both occasions hubby was trying to prove that he could get back from somewhere in record time (in the car) not very funny for me but hes a man, what can you do :roll: anyway, after a fast journey home, round the bends etc. I got out of the car and was still moving, dizzy and feeling sick, it went on for 3 or 4 hours. Most unpleasant. Oh, and I had something similar, coming back on a double decker bus with my daughter. We sat on the top, near the back, it was a two hour journey and the bus was swaying from side to side, nearing home I started to feel quite sick and when I got off, I was still moving, feeling sick and dizzy.

Christine (TMS) is a noninvasive method to cause depolarization or hyperpolarization in the neurons of the brain. TMS uses electromagnetic induction to induce weak electric currents using a rapidly changing magnetic field; this can cause activity in specific or general parts of the brain with minimal discomfort, allowing the functioning and interconnections of the brain to be studied

Thanks for sharing Scott. I need to learn more about mdds because that sounds more like what I have. I never had motion sickness as a child and now I can’t even drive. My vision gets all distorted and I get extremely dizzy.

Does anyone know how to differentiate MAV from mdds?

Thank you.

I don’t know much about TMS, but is there a specific TMS procedure Dr Cha is using for MDDS?..or would any TMS treatment possibly resolve this disorder? Also, does anyone know how accessible TMS treatment is? I don’t think most insurances cover it at this point, but i think I once read that people with severe depression were paying about $200 USD per treatment.
@Mavprincess: i’m not an expert, but i thought people with MDDS felt better in the car? Any vestibular disorder, regardless of what it’s called or if it’s brain or ear related, really stinks! :?

Scott its really interesting to read that article… I didn’t realise the following fact

“Half the people with MdDS will get it like Bruning did, after getting off a plane or a train. The other half will get it spontaneously and usually after a period of extreme stress.”

This is so similar to mav which can aslo be triggered after periods of extreme stress, the reason I believe my symptoms have kicked off.

As I have been susceptible to MDDS twice before, after getting off a boat, I am really wondering if I have this condition and not mav, or maybe a combination of both. I will take it up with my neuro

I’ve read a good bit about Dr Cha, and I once thought to myself: “You know…she would probably diagnose 75% of us on this forum w/ spontaneous MDDS” (because of all the constant rocking and disequilibrium so many of us experience). She suspects MAV is usually rotational vertigo.
Also, in this Q&A article w/ Dr Cha, she said that alot of spontaneous rocking is usually due to a history of migraine, anxiety, severe stress, hormonal changes, or have recently experienced recurrent vertigo. … id=8389704

Thank you for posting that Alternaace. I’ve actually poked around a few MdDS forums. I would say over 75% of those people sound to me like they really have MAV and not MdDS. They seem to be getting relief on the same meds as us as well. They pretty much think that if you are better during motion then that is MdDS. I don’t think that is the case as so many of us feel better with motion and we have MAV.
I’m beginning to think MdDS is over diagnosed.

I too have read quite a bit about Dr. Cha and Mdds and yes, by the strict definition, unless there is rotational vertigo and it is episodic, Mav is not diagnosed. That being said, I have had a few docs say my rocking is Mdds and I had one doc that considers himself a Mav expert say my rocking was part of the Mdds Syndrome (whatever that means). I agree that many on Mdds forums sound exactly like us and not all are there because they had a motion experience preceding their symptoms. This whole diagnosis thing is very distressing but even more distressing is that so many of us are suffering the way we are.

Very interesting. Just a thought here. I wonder if there’s an “MDDS” spectrum disorder. Nowadays, we know there are many other spectrum disorders, like in autism, mental illnesses, etc. Obviously there are different triggers for MDDS (classic motion-induced MDDS vs “spontaneous” groups as i mentioned earlier), but nobody seems to know as much about symptom distribution: for example, why do some MDDSers feel better lying down while others feel worse? Why do some get relief from migraine treatments? It really seems MDDS, MAV, and Chronic Subjective Dizziness all have inevitable symptom overlap.
True, getting the right treatment for symptom relief is the important thing, not the label. Difficult though…

Scott, thanks so much for posting this article. I have the spontaneous MdDS (20 years of constant rocking brought on by intense stress), and what frustrates me is I started seeing a specialist at UCLA neurology back in 2011 and was never told about TMS as a possible cure. And now Dr. Cha has left UCLA for Tulsa, Oklahoma! Does anyone on here know of physicians using TMS to treat MdDS or MdDS-like MAV?


I think there is a doctor in Ohio still conducting tms experiments for this (Dr Clark maybe??). Might be worth having a look!

Thanks, alternaace! :slight_smile: